Kenshiro Abbe and John Warfields teaching styles ?

Hi Dave, I seem to remember reading that you particularly liked the Goshinkwai Yawara taught by John Warfield . I was wondering how much of this was K. Abbe,s teaching and how much had been altered or added to by J.Warfield ( or G.Warfield ) ? Did J.Warfield teach in a similar way to K.Abbe and did K.Abbe teach his self defence / fighting classes differently and/or separately to his judo and aikido ? I've only seen aikido on the tv or video and read a small amount on it but the mind-set seems to be very different to the GSK Combat I have seen so far. Mind you I did see a video clip on the internet where one of the high ranking japanese instructors ( Shioda ? ) just stepped and hit his attacker with a palm strike that dropped him on his back. Did K.Abbe use / teach a different mind-set depending on what and who he was teaching ?

Trevor

thats a very involved question that would require nearly a boom mate...

There were many differences and similarities in the ways in which Abbe and the Warfields approached and taught their methods... even the two brothers taught very differently in some ways.

Although Abbe was better known for his Judo and Aikido,his first love was BUDO and Butokukai Defence. He was an eccentric who was very intense in his teachings and practise... John and Gordon (and Colin for a while) first started in JUDO, then through Abbe they went on to Butokukai Defence.. they learned methods an dmind sets from Abbe, but also spent a lot of time under instructors like Michigami, Otani and others.. when Abbe had gone back to Japan John re-organised what he had learned, added some other methods (including some dance step and some Savaux etc) and turned Butokukai into Goshinkwai

Abbe's combat classes bore little resemblance to his Judo and Aikido classes.. you have to remember that Abbe was an officer in the Japanese Imperial Army and fought for real.. his mind set was quite different from the average Brit due to his life style.
When he went back to Japan he gave the Warfields (especially John) the rights to teach HIS methods of Butokukai Defence, Kyushin-Jutsu and Kyushindo under the name of Goshinkwai.

Gordon moved like Abbe and did some fabulous'combat judo' type stuff and was a whizz with the Sykes-Fairburn knife.. he was also a great dog trainer.. he had some real monsters.. Mabon was one who was 4/5ths bloody wolf I think..

John was more aggressive and his atemis were frankly unbelievable.. his knowledge of movement supreme and his knowledge of the ways in which understanding anatomy and physiology allowed him to cause harm to humans was unsurpassed by anyone I have seen before or since..

It is worth mentioning that a session under John Warfield was different from a session under Gordon, but neither of them taught like Abbe, who was very Japanese.

Thanks for the reply, a book would be good though......
It would have been good to have seen people such as Abbe , Warfield bros, Mifune, and some of the old-time wrestlers. The video of Mifune always makes me want to learn judo. I know modern judo is probably different now and its a demo not a contest or fight but he looks such a class performer. Is there much film of Abbe and is there any of his combat teachings ? I've only seen that short clip of him demonstrating judo which you said was typical of how he was.
Was he ever interviewed by such as Terry O'Neils Fighting Arts for eg ? It would be an interesting article to read if he had been.
I'm looking forward to the GSK Yawara course that is coming up soon at Doncaster as I might not be able to train with the ones that have gone before but I want to take the opportunity to learn from the ones around now.

Trevor

Hi Dave, you mention that John integrated some dance movements into the system. Any chance of elaborating on that.

It does strike me as something that's obviously useful: something like ball-room dancing, correct me if I'm wrong, would involve a heck of a lot of skill in the advanced stages where the partners not only have to move correctly but also 'dodge' and 'avoid' each other in the process.

Hi Rezbi

sorry for the delay..

yes John loved dancing as a source of movement.. you only danced well if you integrated your movement with your partners..
you couldnt work against them.. you had to work WITH them
combat is no different.. your attacker is your partner in combat/.. so mesh with his movements, but control them

easier to say then explain, but a lot easier to demonstrate