Dealing with snipers

Hi Nick

I figured you where probably the best person to ask on here this question given your military experience.

The British Army are doing their usual "what would you do?" recruitment campaign in which they have a series of adverts and posters with various scenarios which then ask you as to what you'd do. For example there's one that says "you have to travel across 50 miles of desert, which vehicle do you take" and there's a choice between a truck and a half track.

One question has a group of British Soldiers taking cover behind a truck and the caption reads "Your patrol is pinned down by snipers, what do you do?".

What is the best way of dealing with snipers if your patrol is pinned down?

I realise this is a strange question to ask on a self defence forum but i'm really curious.

Cheers and regards

Paul

I am no military guy but I guess it's about take sufficient cover, locating the sniper with the crack and thum methodlogy, then putting sufficent suppresive fire while someone flanks the sniper. Or call in air support or artillery.

Above all be the grey man so you will not be picked as a target.

Kind Regards,

Nick Engelen

Ask this guy
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d7f_1175892437
Seriously though,i watched yesterday The Shooter,really good film about snipers.

You don't deal with snipers - snipers deal with you.

A couple of riflemen pinning a patrol down,do not snipers make.

I was reliably informed that the snipers in Bosnia were apparently Olympic class shots..so as Ron says...they are gonna deal with you. .

I would just bear in mind...if they can't see you, they can't shoot you....

Ron Evans wrote:You don't deal with snipers - snipers deal with you.

That was basically my thought but presumably the British Army has a solution in mind.

I could have asked you Ron but i wasn't thinking when i posted this, sorry.

There was once a man who was in the Boer war and was shot in the chest and would have died excpet he ad placed a bible in his brest pocket. After that he always used to have a bible there until the day he went forward to transport wounded to the field hospital.

The british army had place the efective range of a Boer rifle at 800 meters, unfortunately no one told the Boers this and one of them shot him right between the eyes at 1200 meters.

This shows that the bible is good for matters of the heart and not the head and God is in no ones pocket.

It also has very little to with this thread

AXE
Jagunco

Mate,

If you want to know what the Brits would do I could think of no better source than Mick Coup - as I believe he was in the Brit military and I never was.

In the Legion, being we were all about death and glory as opposed to sensible things like tactics, we would probably charge the fooker Me, personally, I'd call in an airstrike.

Nick

PS: We (the Legion) actually were sniped the entire time we were in Bosnia as peacekeepers. The guys would have to run doubled over to the showers and so on because of this slavic arsehole in the hills. The truly sad part to this story is our guys knew exactly where he was the entire time...used to watch him crawling into his hide every day...and would see him fire (this ditz didn't know enough to not have too much oil on his weapon and never to fire from under a bush in the morning as the concussive shockwave will send the dew flying as a mist).

Unfortunately they were under strict orders that they were NOT allowed to fire back and/or kill the c**t.

Ron Evans wrote:A couple of riflemen pinning a patrol down,do not snipers make.

I disagree Ron - any1 firing from a concealed position qualifies as sniper to me....


You can stick a good shot through a sniper course - spend 2 solid weeks shooting, learn stalking, map reading, sneaking, camoflage, intelligence gathering, laser designation etcetc - that makes them "a better sniper" .

The basic tactics and concept is the same.

Same as having a light infantry soldier and a SAS soldier - both are soldiers just one is trained to a hugely higher standard...


If you dont believe me consider Simon Haya and Vasily Zaytsev both NEVER went through any sniper schools! So they were just "squaddies who were good shots"?

Ill bet any russians or germans they shot at were thinking - "OH no the officer is down with a a headshot!!! Hah its ok he cant be a sniper the opposition havent setup there sniper schools yet"

No problem PuP.

But....

As far as I'm concerned,any person firing a rifle from concealment,is no more a sniper than an SAS trooper is a highly trained light infantryman.



Ron.

I did say hugely

It's as different a job as tank driving and bridge building mate.

Ron - i was trying to get across the point "soldier" is a wide label - many roles and indeed skill levels and types of individuals involved under its umbrella.... *

A REME is a soldier a cook can be a soldier - so is a SAS trooper! Different skill levels and roles - but all can take the term soldier.



As i believe happens to be the same case with the labell "sniper".


Some are from the western tradition of being extremely highly trained hugely proficient and equipped. With the discipline to sit in position for days at a time collecting intell before perhaps making a shot as those canadians did in afghanistan at over 2430m's!

Others are from the insurgent tradition in Iraq where they might lie in a carboot and have the driver attempt to get within 50ms to get a shot between the armoured plates of a american...

Or they might lie in the weeds and shoot at an coalition soldier checking for IEDs from 200-400m's. Closer and less skilled then a western trained marksman or sniper but still working on the same sort of role....and still deadly!


That plonker shooting at Nick and the FFL in bosnia - he wasnt very skilled - but he was still working IN a sniper role.


If the threats a gunman firing from a hidden position dont you tend to yell "sniper" instead of "probably not been to sniper school therefore is just a gunman"



*The argument (which ive heard from a highly experience EX-peep) that "the SAS are at the end of the day highly trained light infantry" - has enough for a whole thread of its own.

And not one im qualified in any shape to make. They prolly evolved from Light infantry but obviously have hugely expanded roles nowadays...

How to deal with snipers?

One word. Kata.

WRONG Bri its two words - GUN KATA

Just going back through this and wanted to mention the Legion dropped sniper training and went with sharpshooters instead...big difference in the training.

The original sniper program involved two man teams, navigation skills, camouflage, stalking and even living in the trees for 2 weeks (in Guyanna) as part of the program. Unfortunately one of the graduates (back in the seventies I believe) decided to hire out his skills and once it was discovered they disbanded the training.

The sharpshooter works in the squad with the rest of us, does no training outside of what we do other than he fires his scoped rifle while the rest of us blat away with the FAMAS.

So it would seem that at least according to the Legion there is a difference between a sniper and a sharpshooter by virtue of the skill sets involved.

Nick

send men forward to draw fire while spotters try and locate the sniper.

once found fire tracers at the target to mark him then take him out with what ever mean at your disposal

this i what I do on Xbox